Splendid: It was just a decision to step away from using your own name?

Mark Kozelek: (laughs) That's absolutely right. I'd done two or three records with my name, and I've been doing this thing with Red House Painters for a long time, and I know exactly what is ahead -- what clubs I'm going to be playing, what countries I'll be going to... it's been the same for twelve years. It's the same experience over and over and I thought, "What is one thing that I can do differently to change things a little bit?" I figured there are just as many people who don't like me as do, so maybe if I give it a band name and people hear I'm just a guy in this band it might be more interesting.

Splendid: Do you feel there is a stigma attached to the Red House Painters brand?

Mark Kozelek: Well, I feel that when you're in a band that's been at it for years and every album you make sells the same amount and your tours play the same venues... ... I feel that I'm blessed to be making music for a living, don't misunderstand me, but there is a limitation (if not a stigma) when you've been doing it for this long. I remember looking for record deals when we were shopping Songs for a Blue Guitar and Old Ramon and there are just as many labels who wouldn't sign us because our records sell a certain amount. It's like we're proven -- we have this track record of only selling a certain amount of records. By some labels' standards that might be impressive, but by others' it sucks and it's nothing -- they don't want anything to do with you because you've proven what your worth is. I guess I've reached the point where I'm fine with selling the same amount of records, but at the same time I'm completely open to opening things up and having different people come out to see me play that maybe otherwise wouldn't because I'm this guy that they heard plays acoustic AC/DC covers.

Splendid: Sun Kil Moon's sound is markedly different from the last Red House Painters album, but do you see a stylistic shift in your songwriting? Is it tied to maturing as a songwriter or is it related to an interest in different sounds at different times? I'm thinking specifically of the instrumentation on the new album.

Mark Kozelek: If there are any changes...it's definitely not conscious. This new album was recorded pretty organically -- even the Portuguese guitar... that was something that was just given to me that I used on one song, "Glen Tipton". Then I had the idea to use it to come up with string arrangements that people would come in and play over, but I ended up liking the way the Portuguese guitar sounded. It gave the record a sort of Mediterranean feel, which I wasn't going for at all, but it ended up that way. A few people have told me that this new record for them embodies a lot of different things throughout my career, and I think that's a little bit true. I can hear a little bit of Songs for a Blue Guitar on something like "Salvador Sanchez", and with "Duk Koo Kim" there is the fourteen-minute epic song that brings me back to "Funhouse" or "Katy Song" with that kind of dramatic build-up. "Glen Tipton" reminds me of those acoustic solo records. So I think a lot of different styles and approaches that I've used over the years appear on Ghosts of the Great Highway.

Splendid: I wonder specifically about "Duk Koo Kim" since there are now three recorded versions available -- you're even exploring a lot of these sounds from the past on a single song. The song seems to have hypnotized you...

Mark Kozelek: It's a good song! (laughs) Originally, I recorded the acoustic version because Cameron Crowe had seen us play and he wanted to use the alternate version of "Have You Forgotten" for his movie Vanilla Sky. He also liked "Duk Koo Kim", but we weren't really given a budget to record the song -- we just got this casual invitation to record the song and it was not really official. So we did the band version of "Have You Forgotten" because I knew doing a full-band version of "Duk Koo Kim" (at fourteen minutes in length) would cost me a lot of money out of my pocket. So I just recorded an acoustic version at a friend's house. I turned "Duk Koo Kim" in but they didn't use it. Later, they created this record label (Vinyl Records) and they said, "Hey Mark, how about using "Duk Koo Kim" for a vinyl and you can think of something you'd like to use as a b-side?" I remembered a show recorded in Indianapolis with "Duk Koo Kim" and I thought that would be cool -- using both the acoustic version and the live version. Of course, it was something I'd played with my band forever so eventually it just made perfect sense to record it for the Sun Kil Moon album. It was really all coincidence that there ended up being three versions -- if Cameron Crowe had never called me about recording it for the movie, I never would've recorded it on my own. I knew it was something that I would eventually do with the band, but at that time I just couldn't afford to.

Splendid: In any Mark Kozelek song there seems to be a transparency to the autobiographical elements -- or at least what listeners would assume is autobiographical. Are you conscious of how much you reveal about yourself?

Mark Kozelek: Yes, sometimes. But sometimes I don't know. It's so natural for me to write the way I write that I don't really realize that I'm putting myself out there in that way until someone else says, "Oh my god." I feel that as my writing continues to develop, the stuff is becoming more ambiguous. I used to be really literal and I used to be very adamant about lyrics being literally about exactly whatever was going on in the song. And I've become less focused on that -- every line doesn't need to say exactly what I want to say. It doesn't need to express that specificity any more. Sometimes I write lines and I don't even know what they mean, but I know they came out of me for a reason. I feel like the new stuff is a little more ambiguous -- songs used to be specifically about one girl. Now songs can be about anything... look at "Glen Tipton". It's about my dad, it's about a woman I knew that passed away, there are references to boxers and guys in heavy metal bands. One song can be about many different things now, so I feel like in some way the way I go about lyrics now is more open and less tight and precise.

Splendid: Are you a very different person day-to-day from the musician that performs on stage? It shocked me to hear you talk between songs the first time I saw a Red House Painters concert. I don't know what I expected, but you talk quite a lot and you tell stories...

Mark Kozelek: (nervously) In a bad way?

Splendid: Well... you always strike me as very humble, but there are also the prerequisite references to a woman in each town...

Mark Kozelek: (laughs) Well, you know, the main thing I can say about that is this: I can't help but have a sense of humour about myself and my life. Of course there is a reality to who I am and to these songs. I remember when I worked on the movie Almost Famous, I was down in Los Angeles for seven months and there was nothing to write about. There are just things in your daily life that don't come out in music. I go fishing, I play pool sometimes, but there are things that just don't come out. With regards to women, I've spent a lot of my life being single so a lot of that has happened on tours. I've received a lot of criticism for that from people because it comes as such a surprise to them. But I've pretty much lived as a free spirit for many years (with a few stops to that) and there is no way to keep a straight face with everything that you do. I'm human and I have a pulse, but you're right -- sometimes I don't know what people expect, but I have a sense of humour. It's also important to remember that all this music is not about one person.

Splendid: I'm laughing because I'm thinking about something that you said once and I'm debating whether or not I should bring it up. But to me it perfectly sums you up in a lot of ways. At a solo show in Detroit you made a comment to the lighting guy to turn the spotlights lower and told the audience, "You've probably all seen the herpes sore on my face by now." And everyone laughed while you went straight into a fluid and romantic performance of "Bad Boy Boogie". You disarmed everyone...

Mark Kozelek: (laughing) By singing an AC/DC song that is all about chasing women!

Splendid: People ask you a lot about the cover songs, and you're always pretty clear that it's not about liking the originals, but rather what you think you can do with the material. There are no covers on the new album -- is it just what comes across your lap at any given time or do you pick them out with the intention of going back to them later?

Mark Kozelek: They just come to me at random, and not one has come to me in a really long time. Which is good, because I felt one more record of cover songs and I think I would have been known more as a song interpreter than a songwriter. I think I got that out of my system, although I'm sure I'll do covers again.

Splendid: The solo albums on Badman Recording Co. really stood as great examples of how strong your songs stand-up unadorned -- would you be satisfied releasing music that way or does some of the material demand treatment from a full-band?

Mark Kozelek: I think in time I'll record another solo record, and I do like recording that way. But to be satisfied doing it that way every time -- no. I feel the need to surprise people from time to time, which is why I did the AC/DC cover albums in the first place. I like to change things and I don't want to be one of those bands that you know what the album is going to sound like before it comes out -- you know the formula. There are some great bands like that -- AC/DC is one of them. But I really don't like that for myself. I really want things to be different and for people to not be sure what to expect.

Splendid: Do you think all of the solo tours in support of the acoustic albums helped you develop as a performer and a songwriter? Your voice during live performances, for example, has improved leagues beyond where it was in the past.

Mark Kozelek: I don't know about songwriting, but definitely performing. Songwriting maybe to the extent that those tours allowed me to accumulate life experiences. Part of "Duk Koo Kim", for example, was written while I was on tour in South Korea -- being out of your element in a way that you're forced to be creative. There is no schedule for the songwriting thing. I pick up the guitar every day -- I don't try to, I just naturally do because there are guitars lying all around my house. I'll pick one up and sometimes only music comes out, sometimes a song comes out.

Splendid: So it doesn't always take a broken heart?

Mark Kozelek: No. It can be many things and it can be things that happened five years ago. There are things that have happened in my life in the last year that I won't get around to looking at until later. Sometimes "in the moment" is not the time to write about it; it takes time to really look back and see what something was.

Splendid: Given the size of your body of work, when we talk about that distance from experiences, what about distance from your songs? Are you able to pick favorite songs or favorite LPs? Are there certain Red House Painters songs that continue to excite you?

Mark Kozelek: That's a really good question. There are some that will always have a certain longevity and staying power with me personally, that have a certain sentimental value to me. There are other songs that I'm always going to play for whatever reason, like maybe I sing them well, but for some reason they stick with me -- but those aren't the best ones. It's a different thing with the public and the people who listen -- they can have a different idea of what their favorite song is. If I had to think of one song to be played over my grave I'd have to say "Katy Song." That song, where ever I go, people yell for that song -- every country, every place I've ever been, it seems to be the one common denominator. There is some strength or some beauty about that one song that seems to bring it to the surface. And that's the one song that, when we don't play it, people are mad about it. (laughs)

Splendid: How does it feel to know you've created something that people are so strongly attached to?

Mark Kozelek: It's good, it's good. It feels really good. When I played in South Korea, just to be there -- I played two sold-out shows -- in a country where everyone lines up at the end of the show to give you something or to exchange something with you. It's beautiful. It is so beautiful and I feel like it's happening in the third person. I can't believe it's happening to me -- this guy who grew up in Ohio and spent four years in remedial reading and was told he wasn't going to amount to anything. It's beautiful to be somewhere in the world with these people and their foreign accents who have so much respect for you and the music means so much to them.

Splendid: What are your expectations for the Sun Kil Moon album? I realize you say you know exactly what to expect, but what do you hope for? Is it to travel to a new place, to sell a few more records, what?

Mark Kozelek: I'm almost thirty-seven years old, and what I hope for now is happiness and a secure future. I hope something happens so that the guys in my band who have been with me forever and are still tending bar and driving a taxi will be able to live for a couple of years off of money they've made through this. They've put a lot of time into it. I hope to own a home eventually and I hope to have medical insurance so that if I have a family I will be able to take care of them. Things that you don't really think about when your in your twenties, but then your in your thirties and you find out a friend has leukemia... and you just want to be able to take care of yourself and the people around you. So if selling a lot of records or being on television or in movies helps make that happen, then that's what I hope for.